Elvis - A Lighted Candle

[ALNA]

intresting read from all of you

[Golden Sky]

I agree with you, Alna, this is an interesting conversation!

Thank you, Laurie, for your reply. You know, sometimes I think that people like us have a calling to bring religion our of its Dark Ages and modify or advance it into the New Age...in other words, to integrate old with new. It's a birth of sorts, and pain attends it like it attends all births. I used to think I could just dive into spirituality without ever having to look at traditional religions, but life taught me otherwise, and now I'm glad that I know something of the Bible and can relate to Christians, and can extricate the wisdom from the parts of Scripture I feel no use for. I used to hold the Bible in contempt when I was young, then was I overzealous about it, but now I am comfortably detached and still able to gain from its riches. It was a journey. Perhaps yours has been like this too.

So many Christians, and people of all faiths, are in such a state of bondage, it grieves me. I just try to do my best to bridge the gap... speaking considerately (I hope) but holding my ground and arguing when I have to. I'm thankful I passed through the fire of Calvinism so I can relate to even the most staunch of believers.

It's very tense at times, but I see it as a part of my life's work. I also see Elvis as a major, driving force in this integration phase...don't you? And Laurie, I must say, you're doing a very fine job here. Probably more people than you ever guessed read your posts and mull over your vision.

Mari, you're always a sweetheart and thank you for taking the time to talk me through my re-entry! I enjoyed reading your inspiring thoughts on this also...again, it sounds like we've taken some of the same paths.

Always amazing talking to you all.
Love,
Trish

[MaryInTheMorning]

Trish my sweet friend, you are, as always, more than welcome for any help that I can give you!! If you ever need anything, I'm but a mere post or pm away dear one!! I must say that I enjoyed reading your very wise, enlightening and inspiring thoughts here too dear angel! Yes, my heart feels that we have truly travelled some of the same paths together too!!

[Blue Moon]

Thank you, Laurie, for your reply. You know, sometimes I think that people like us have a calling to bring religion our of its Dark Ages and modify or advance it into the New Age...in other words, to integrate old with new.

I agree Trish, about bridging the old ways of spiritual thinking with the new. There is truth in the old, but also error. So it behooves one to not throw all of the old out, as some do, and then run into the new w/o any foundation. Just because there is limitations & error in the old doesn't mean it's all wrong.

"Hell" is another subject which comes to mind. For the sake of space here, I'll keep my experience brief, but a few years ago I had a strong intuition that the "Hell" Jesus was speaking of was referring to the hell of this world rather than the next. At the time, I didn't have much to back it up with behond my intuition and I didn't have the patience to do years of deep Bible study or ancient history.

However, last week I was listening on the radio to a man named Craig Hogan speak on where the fire & brimstone judgement Hell came from. And btw I posted his web site a days back in the Field of Roses section. He says that the traditional view of Hell is neither in the Old or New Testaments. In the Old T, the word for Hell is Sheol (hope I spelled it right) which simply means unseen. In the New T, the word for Hell is Gahenna. He says that Gahenna was quite literally a trash dump just outside of Jeruselum. This lays a nice background to my belief that Jesus was trying to show a way of living to set people free from the oppressive nature of this world's sytem. And he said that whatever he could do we could as well. Can you imagine if we all knew how to levitate as Jesus did? We wouldn't have to worry about getting the money for a new car. I know of a Native American friend btw who does know how to levitate. He lives hundreds of miles away so I've never seen him do it but I've never known him to lie or exaggerate. He is a simple humble spriitual man.

Back to the history of "Hell". It seems the firey judgment Hell was actually borrowed from Greek paganism, i.e. Homer, Virgil etc. and incorporated into the Church system as a means of control. I think it was the 2nd century when it was first introduced.

I just have to add that I'm not saying that there is no accountability for our actions here on Earth, only that it has been blown out of proportion and used as a means of manipulation & control, and has been so insitutionalized (and not just in Christianity but other religions too) that even folks who have no desire to control others believe in its common interpretion.

Do I know for sure that Mr. Hogan is right in all historical facts? No, but what he says does fit my intuition on the subject, so I was pretty impressed by what he had to say.

I wonder what Elvis' thoughts on this subject would be. Not sure if it's in Larry's new book or not as I have not yet finished reading it. Hope I have not stepped on any toes by brining up this subject. I'm sure others will not agree but this a place where on can freely express.

[Sarena]

I had a strong intuition that the "Hell" Jesus was speaking of was referring to the hell of this world rather than the next.

That's also my opinion, Laurie, and I agree very much with your explanation, which to me is in no way offensive

[MaryInTheMorning]

I had a strong intuition that the "Hell" Jesus was speaking of was referring to the hell of this world rather than the next.

That's also my opinion, Laurie, and I agree very much with your explanation, which to me is in no way offensive

I have to say that I agree with what both of you have said here my dear friends, and I am in no way offended either sweet Laurie. I greatly appreciate the detail you went into with your very insightful thoughts, and you are very right with saying that ELC is a place where one can freely express their thoughts, feelings, etc... so no worries my sweet angel .

[Wanda June Hill]

Laurie asked me to post what Elvis thought, if I knew. We did discuss that and he read so many scriptures and because he was studying words and etc: and apparently Hebrew also though we never discussed that, other than he had a few books that explained the different words and their meanings etc: regarding the ancient language the Bible was written in-comparing it to modern wordings.

He thought it was of the "mind" and that if we were not among the "chosen" who would rank highest etc;...and be closer to Jesus and the lord and do good things in spirit form etc:, those not trying while on earth, not spiritually committed (he had to explain he didn't mean put in prison or somewhere else here, I remember he said he didn't mean I was "too uneducated to understand, he just wanted to explain better" , that those persons/spiritual beings, would be on lower ranks, having to start from "scratch" and would find it like a burning of the mind because they had been sluggards about doing God's deeds while on earth. They would look at "us who try hard to do good unto others" (God's most important deed he felt) and it would be like a hell to know what a wasted life they'd had- and that the most wicked of them would not redeem themselves for a very long time- thus the meaning of "ever lasting fire". I don't have it written down, so that's just what I can recall, and it's not much considering he went on and on for a while, then a couple weeks or so later he called again and picked right up where he left off-and talked somemore with a different book in hand.

I agree with what he said, I think it is of the mind and spirit and it could be like burning in hell with remorse etc;.

I'm glad I am to post this, I got cut off several times since I logged on- something is going on out there in space I think...messing with our phone lines and magnetic energy. wjh

[Blue Moon]

Thanks Sarena & Mari for your comments & Wanda too for expressing your own & Elvis' thoughts on the matter.

I think the human will is important too. If one does not want to be with God, then one's will be honored in my opinion. "Love" is key, though. Even an athiest who has love in his heart will want to be with God upon his death because God is love.

Also, fear can be a factor too. Not all the Near Death Experiences are of peace love & white light at the end of a tunnel. Some speak of a hellish experience. I think the latter believed they deserved such an awful place so their mind/soul sent them there. Reminds me of the movie "What Dreams May Come".

[MaryInTheMorning]

You are very welcome dear Laurie! Sweet Wanda thank you so much for sharing yours, as well as our dear Elvis' views and thoughts on this. I can very well see and understand his views, and as always they are, as are your own, very insightful and wise!!

[Golden Sky]

Hi everyone,

Thank you again for this very interesting conversation. I can't believe in the traditional view of hell either. Laurie, thank you for explaining about the real meanings in the Bible. It does mention the lake of fire, "where the worm dyeth not," and there are other details, but I have never been unerstood how it all comes together under one banner called Hell. I refuse to believe in it and it actually sounds like an amalgam of all the places of negativity listed in the Bible.

But I do think bad karma can carry over lifetimes, if reincarnation is true.
And hell IS on earth that's for sure. I just can't think that all suffering is "karmic" or meant as punishment. Especially as some suffering leads to enlightenment for the people who survive.

Wanda I'm wondering if Elvis ever talked about theosophy with you and the the theosophical worldview. I am completely fascinated by it, after picking up a book by Dane Rudhyar. I know Elvis liked Rudhyar's book "New Mansions for New Men." The book I have by him is called "The Astrology of Personality" and it is absolutely excellent. I would recommend it to anyone here.

Rudhyar also talks about a sort of spiritual hierarchy, and it sounds like what you were talking about above. Only the "chosen" would be the "seed people" or "masters." Any thing you remember about that? Was Elvis "past" that phase of thought when you were talking with him, meaning, did he not believe in theosophy any more? Did he ever refer to the "Masters"? It sounds like he reverted back to a somewhat more Bible-based view of time and the afterlife, from what you said above.

Many thanks if you have any insights there.

Love,
Trish

[MaryInTheMorning]

You're very welcome dear Trish, and thank you for all of your thoughts and input, as well as your recommendation for Dane Rudhyar's book "The Astrology of Personality!!" It sounds like a great book, and one that Elvis would've enjoyed reading too.

[Rainbow Light]

It sounds like a great book, and one that Elvis would've enjoyed reading too.

AMEN!

[Wanda June Hill]

Hi, just getting to read this quickly, Elvis had so many books, and read things way over my head. He soon realized that though I read alot of things, they weren't complicated, and I wasn't inclined to study long enough, Gemini trait no doubt, skim the surface and go on. I'm sure it bugged him often when he drew a blank slate from me on many subjects. He tried to teach me, and he was a good theacher; mainly we shared similar interests in the Bible and other related books. I liked his style of viewing things, he could see past the words, look through the eyes of the writer or something, because he came up with views so new to me, and I had been raised for years in the "holy roller" kind of religions views. And believed those who were preaching to us were sincere and devout people working for the Lord. I still do think they were sincere at that time and doing God's work, although I have learned in my 68 and 1/2 years, to see things a little differently. I can't come up with the right word for it, but I'm sure lots of us older folk know of what I speak- time changes things as surely as the ocean changes the beaches of our earth, etc;...

Got to go, Starla is leaving for the day-working in San Diego today...I bet it's muggy down there for sure!

wjh

[Rainbow Light]

Thank you as always, Wanda!

It seems like many of Elvis' books went over your, my and others' heads as well so you're not on your own there, dear lady! However, Elvis had a certain way of seeing things of his own, teaching, showing and inspiring so many in his very unique way!

[73smile]

Wanda I know what you mean. I read a great deal but there are many times I have to look things up so that I can then put the message of the author into a context that I can understand and relate to.
I love to read biographies and books abouth the earth insofar as I can relate to what the message is to be.
We are all different and you actually had your own private teacher. I am happy for you about that but that I did not have an opportunity to see Elvis much less have him teach me what an author was saying.
73smile